Type 9 into a Gtc

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Type 9 into a Gtc

Post by Scimfancier » Tue Oct 29, 2019 11:09 am

I’ve just bought a heavy duty type9 gearbox with the long input shaft and I’m thinking about putting it in my Gtc as the gear shift in it is horrendous.
The new gearbox is from a 2.8 Sierra 4x4 but it’s had the transfer part of it removed, it has an alloy bell-housing which is for a cable clutch.
What I’m wondering is, will it fit on my cast bell housing and be a straight forward swop or will there be lots of other issues that make it a no goer.


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Type 9 into a Gtc

Post by Roger Pennington » Tue Oct 29, 2019 2:12 pm

In a general sense, it can certainly be done. I used to know the owner of GTC107 which had been fitted with a type 9. Unfortunately he's now sold the car and moved away, so I've lost touch with both. I'm pretty sure it had a cable clutch (and presumably a modded pedal box?).
Presumably you'd also need to consider things like the speedo drive and the propshaft? Someone with more knowledge than me will probably be along shortly :)


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Type 9 into a Gtc

Post by philhoward » Tue Oct 29, 2019 3:13 pm

I don't believe the type 9 fits the original GTC bellhousing directly.

If there's a type 9 fitted to a GTC with a cable clutch, it was probably converted using a Middlebridge pedal box (when they were easily available - back in the early/mid 90's)?


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Type 9 into a Gtc

Post by Roger Pennington » Tue Oct 29, 2019 3:53 pm

It could well have been done in the '90s - I last saw the car in approx 2011/12 when it was being readied for sale, and I think it had stood for at least 5 years prior to that


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Type 9 into a Gtc

Post by efi_sprintgte » Tue Oct 29, 2019 5:11 pm

Scimfancier wrote:
Tue Oct 29, 2019 11:09 am
I’ve just bought a heavy duty type9 gearbox with the long input shaft and I’m thinking about putting it in my Gtc as the gear shift in it is horrendous.
The new gearbox is from a 2.8 Sierra 4x4 but it’s had the transfer part of it removed, it has an alloy bell-housing which is for a cable clutch.
What I’m wondering is, will it fit on my cast bell housing and be a straight forward swop or will there be lots of other issues that make it a no goer.

What gearbox is your existing bellhousing for?

The Cologne to type 9 bellhousing is difference to the manual O/D bellhousing.

Fortunately the Cologne to type 9 bellhousing is very common.


JC

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Type 9 into a Gtc

Post by philipmasonfrance » Tue Oct 29, 2019 5:16 pm

Where's Jim? I had a Type 9 box fitted to my GTC at the time - Olympic Blue VTO 68Y. It was fitted by Dave .... over at Silverstone. Cable clutch? I don't think so as I seem to remember there was a small issue with it which needed a bit of sorting and my (vague) memory - we are talking about approx. 1985/6 - is that it was hydraulic adjustment needed. To be honest, I left the mechanickery at the time to "experts" as I could afford to pay them in those days. Anyway, I digress. Main thing is - do it!! It transformed that car and the new box was an absolute delight.



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Type 9 into a Gtc

Post by gtcse8 » Tue Oct 29, 2019 5:18 pm

Over the years I have had/done/helped with a few GB conversions,

Alan Wells` Red GTC was a conversion, but I can`t remember which box was used.
Over to you Alan.
Bill Sims fitted a type 9 into his old SE5a IIRC, and I had to shorten the input shaft.
There are at least Two lengths of input shaft fitted to type 9.

Phil the type 9 has an Alloy bolt on housing and IIRC it is the Later metric type and will bolt straight onto a metric Cologne
Been messing with Kevin Toltons bodged up GTC conversion earlier this year, but his has retained the hydraulic clutch, and an early OD Type F box mated to the Original Cologne.


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Type 9 into a Gtc

Post by ScimmyMike » Tue Oct 29, 2019 5:42 pm

Speedo drive's are compatible between gear boxes, didn't change mine at least, also prop shaft will be changed, you've probably got a 2 piece fitted as my 6b had, single piece was fitted to mine, the cable clutch requires an extension welding to existing clutch pedal to allow a cable clutch to work, there are some sketches knocking about on here showing what's required, check your alloy bell housing it's probably for a 3 bolt starter motor, mine was and is still in garage,(I really need to ebay that sometime) Dave Mac sorted a replacement cast one out for the conversion.


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Type 9 into a Gtc

Post by gtcse8 » Tue Oct 29, 2019 6:00 pm

PDF TYPE 9 GEARBOX.pdf
(694.36 KiB) Downloaded 27 times
PDF TYPE 9 GEARBOX 2.pdf
(643.77 KiB) Downloaded 23 times
JPEG TYPE 9 GB.jpg
JPEG TYPE 9 GB.jpg (197.46 KiB) Viewed 665 times
JPEG TYPE 9 GB 2.jpg
JPEG TYPE 9 GB 2.jpg (185.81 KiB) Viewed 665 times


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Type 9 into a Gtc

Post by scimjim » Tue Oct 29, 2019 6:17 pm

There’s some info in the wiki, beware some of the rubbish on the net.

My/Philip’s type 9 2.9i GTC had a hydraulic conversion which was simply a bracket welded onto the alloy bellhousing to mount a slave cylinder.

You don’t need to shorten the input shaft if you use the original bellhousing on a Cologne but I have no idea how deep the cast original is?

Lever position is another issue, it will be too far rearward as standard.


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Type 9 into a Gtc

Post by spegru » Tue Oct 29, 2019 7:00 pm

Having done several Zetec to Type 9 conversions, I am aware of the commonality of bellhousing/Engine bolt pattern esp for the 4 cylinder engines between Pinto/CVH/Zetec and I think also Crossflow and others.
However I am also aware that the for the v6 models the bolt pattern and input shaft length are different from the 4 cyl models. Similar - but the top two bolts are closer together on the v6s. The input shaft can be shortened to fit a 4 cyl engine to a v6 box as long as you swap the belhousing as well.

What I do not know for sure is whether the Essex and Cologne v6s have the same engine bolt pattern, but if they do and if they do Essex to type 9 could be as easy as with a Zetec just as long as the box came from a car that originally had a v6.

What can v6 experts tell me about Essex/Cologne bolt patterns? (and maybe also Duratec v6?)



PS some very easy clutch release arm mods are needed for the Zetec conversion using the original Zetec flywheel/clutch since the clutch on the FWD cars is slimmer than in RWD and a CVH-sierra compatible starter is also needed



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Type 9 into a Gtc

Post by scimjim » Tue Oct 29, 2019 7:10 pm

Technically there is no “V6 type 9”, the 2.8 is different to the 2.3.

Essex and cologne bolt patterns are totally different.


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Type 9 into a Gtc

Post by Geraint SabreGTCse5 » Tue Oct 29, 2019 8:18 pm

I have converted a number of scimitars to a type 9 boxe as the original gear change can be like steering porridge. I have a just finished my second GTC which I put a capri 2.8 five speed and bell housing in, this has a cable clutch very easy to fit. The props for all my conversions, be it my se5 or the GTC came from my scimitar spares. I did a 6b and found the gear lever was close to the cubby box so when I did my first GTC a local firm cut a section of the gearbox tail off removing a section and rewelding it making the gear stick closer to the engine. I can't explain why but this wasn't necessary for my first gtc conversion and I ended up using an un modified box. Likewise my latest GTC has an unaltered box fitted and the gear stick is in the correct position. I do use ss1 gearstick though which has a slight bend. I like the type 9 but they are getting rare and expensive from the 2.8 capri.

edit anyone have a workshop manual supplement for the type 9?


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Type 9 into a Gtc

Post by scimjim » Tue Oct 29, 2019 8:24 pm

The SS1 stick has a 45 deg bend :D

I have the type 9 Ford manual in dropbox (from Tony Idle IIRC?) if you want?


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Type 9 into a Gtc

Post by Geraint SabreGTCse5 » Tue Oct 29, 2019 8:27 pm

scimjim wrote:
Tue Oct 29, 2019 8:24 pm
The SS1 stick has a 45 deg bend :D

I have the type 9 Ford manual in dropbox (from Tony Idle IIRC?) if you want?
:D three ss1 sticks on the shelf each has a different bend angle..... can't beat a hand built motor :D


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