SS1 Springs

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Re: SS1 Springs

Post by philhoward » Sun Sep 19, 2010 9:12 pm

I think the key, Andy, is "balance" - original fronts may be below the orignal 180-ish anyway, so going to 275 fronts will probably allow going to that sort of figure Viv has with ease - plus polys on the front translates more of the "real" poundage rather than the rubber bushes taking some of it up. There is also the non-linear rear arm movement that Craig knows all too well and has spent years trying to eliminate!


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Re: SS1 Springs

Post by CNHSS1 » Sun Sep 19, 2010 11:10 pm

pleas search for the various posts on SS1/SST suspension subjects, been covered before. AJL is correct and found out the hard way.

with std front springs, anything above 250lb Rr is asking for trouble for the road. 200-225 is OK.
theres a huge amount to the whys and wherefores and after 10 years competing in SS1s having tried all the spring combinations F&R, i still dont know it all but dont stick 300s on the rear with std fronts as it will kill you or the bus queue...
as for 300s on the rear with 'uprated' fronts, for the road id still say no, even with sticky track rubber. When i ran 300 rears with the best slick rear tyres available, twice as wide as a std SS1 and uber sticky, it would still break away savagely, much of its to do with the design and inherent 'features' of semi trailing arm rear suspension.
also remember that the spring rate isnt the wheel rate (rate that the wheel actually 'sees'), so percentage changes at the spring dont correlate at the wheel


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Re: SS1 Springs

Post by Coco La Blanc » Mon Sep 20, 2010 12:15 pm

Craig/Andy,
I agree with what's being said, to a point, however I have a heavier car on the back end (eg. including a bigger petrol tank) therefore my experience is somewhat different to yours. I did not and would not have considered using the 300lbs/8" Rears with standard Front springs and since Curbruff I have been playing around with the settings to achieve a firm but comfortable and fairly neutral ride - this I believe I have achieved and am very pleased with the outcome. I may well have taken a slightly different approach, with different poundage springs if it had been Ben's SS1 1800Ti (or my SS1 1800Ti sprint car).
Regards,
Viv

ps. Craig - quite happy for you to give it a test drive at some time and obviously would be interested in your feedback.



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Re: SS1 Springs

Post by CNHSS1 » Mon Sep 20, 2010 12:31 pm

no worries Viv, happy to.

yes the GRP bodied SS cars are heavier, which will have an effect on the spring rates, but it doesnt change the rear suspension design or geometry, which is part of the issue allied to the rates.

as Phil H has said, having spent 10 years imrpoving the handling of SS cars, im not going to show all the info/reasons here (all my compie comrades would know as much as me then :mrgreen: ). Maybe when i have finished with SS1s i shall let you all into the secrets :wink:

I'm not going to labour the point further, as adults you can make your own choices :D
Last edited by CNHSS1 on Mon Sep 20, 2010 2:14 pm, edited 1 time in total.


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Re: SS1 Springs

Post by tonypenfold » Mon Sep 20, 2010 1:05 pm

What did AVO think would be a good spring rate for the front,then,Viv?
I do understand they cant supply it(non standard diameter),but I`d be interested to hear their ideas.



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Re: SS1 Springs

Post by reliant-reviver » Mon Sep 20, 2010 1:39 pm

Right, couple of delays, but have now placed the order, so should be ready for delivery in 2 weeks time.

As a side note. My CVH engined SS1 runs 275lbs front, 300 lbs rear (10" springs I believe) and is a little tail happy, but very manageable.
The Ti I have fitted with 275lbs front and 200 lbs rear (because thats all I had at the time) though this will shortly be changed to 250lbs at the rear.
8" rear springs do sound awfully short to me, surely the spring seat has to be wound nearly to the top of the body to retain any form of *sensible ride height?

*Sensible ride height, in my books, is no less than 5.5" at the jacking points.


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Re: SS1 Springs

Post by CNHSS1 » Mon Sep 20, 2010 2:17 pm

tony penfold wrote:What did AVO think would be a good spring rate for the front,then,Viv?
I do understand they cant supply it(non standard diameter),but I`d be interested to hear their ideas.
AVOs advice to AJL (see one of the other threads) was way off unfortunately. They are looking at the issue purely from an isolated shock/spring point of view, rather than an applied to a scimitar suspension design point of view.

Personally i have great respect for AVO (they supplied my racer shocks) but they arent mind readers which i sometimes think as customers that they ought to be :lol:


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Re: SS1 Springs

Post by reliant-reviver » Fri Oct 01, 2010 10:25 am

*sigh*

Spot the cock up

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I felt rather bad telling the manufacturer of their mistake, and a big mistake indeed with the amount of springs I ordered :oops:

Should hopefully have the replacement batch through by the end of next week.


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Re: SS1 Springs

Post by CNHSS1 » Fri Oct 01, 2010 11:23 am

er, sorry must be being dim, whats the cock up?
looks spelt ok from here


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Re: SS1 Springs

Post by reliant-reviver » Fri Oct 01, 2010 11:25 am

Spring ends have been ground. Could get away with it at one end, but not both :(


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Re: SS1 Springs

Post by tonypenfold » Fri Oct 01, 2010 2:49 pm

Thank God I`m not the only one to have senior moments!
Obviously spring makers are getting older,too!



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Re: SS1 Springs

Post by neil stevenson » Sun Oct 03, 2010 11:42 pm

Can you explain why not both ends please?


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Re: SS1 Springs

Post by reliant-reviver » Mon Oct 04, 2010 8:13 am

SS1 springs should be formed with CLOSED and UNGROUND ends, this leaves them with a "step" which when fitted, locates the spring in the lower wishbone seat and prevents it rotating. the spring to chassis location is isolated by a rubber doughnut, which is stepped to mirror the spring end profile.
The above springs have been formed with closed and ground ends, leaving them with a flat seat. This could have been overcome at one end by removing the rubber isolator. But it is not possible to seat ground springs in the lower wishbone, well, I considered the use of the upper rubber isolator, turned upside down, but whilst it would work, it's not advisable.


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Re: SS1 Springs

Post by neil stevenson » Mon Oct 04, 2010 1:51 pm

Thanks for the explanation, should have been able to work that one out for myself but it must have been too late at night.


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Re: SS1 Springs

Post by reliant-reviver » Wed Oct 13, 2010 11:08 am

Right,
the springs have arrived and are all correct this time around!

I'll offer them up here first, and the remainder will be up for grab via buy it now on Ebay (at a slightly higher price due to the fees!)

"Road" spec: Sold out
250lbs/in rating
* -10mm at resting ride height.

Image


"Fast Road" spec: Sold out
300lbs/in rating
* -15mm at resting ride height

Image

Colletion in person or delivery via the Scimaritans is always welcome. Postage otherwise is £5.95 via courier.

To purchase a set of springs please email me via philipjandrew@hotmail.com to arrange payment via Paypal, bank transfer or cheque.

Cheers, Phil

* This is an approximate figure due to the variations in weight between CVH / CA18ET engined cars and SS1/Sabre bodies.
Last edited by reliant-reviver on Thu May 31, 2012 12:15 pm, edited 1 time in total.


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'74 Robin Super Saloon, '84 SS1 1300, '86 SS1 1800ti, '87 SS1 1300
Previous: I lost count around fifty.

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